Hello everybody,
My 2 exit nodes servers are ArachnideFR35 and ArachnideFR35v2, with respective observed bandwidth of approximately 100Mb/s and 30 Mb/s (12 200 KB/s and 3800 kB/s). They are momentarily down since I have decided today to put them down while I will be trying to solve this enormous Irdeto/IP-Echelon problem.
I want to keep my servers alive but I realize that it will not be possible if harassment doesn't stop quickly. My ISP is just transmitting to me a huge amount of abuse complaints every day (and never makes any comment) but they are too many and the incredible patience of my ISP cannot be unlimited. And all this, despite of the fact that my reverse DNS are set, since the first day, to http://digi00277.torproxy-readme-arachnide-fr-35.fr and http://digi00433.torproxy-readme-arachnide-fr-35.fr with the Tor Exit Notice on port 80. And it is this address that appears into the Tor Relay lists.
I have decided to temporarily shut down my servers today (November 13, 2013, 14:50 UTC) while I'm trying to solve this enormous Irdeto/IP-Echelon problem, and to send a mail to my ISP to tell them that I will try to fix this problem before to restart my servers.
Since August 18, 2013, the two machines that I'm running as Tor Relays are full exit nodes (reject *:25, *:26, *:27, accept *:*) (before it, since May 2013, they was only Relays nodes) because I was thininking that : if there is abuse complaints, I will be able to face them. I'm not the only one in this case (accept *:*), But as I see in this mailing-list it seems that the amount of abuse complaint I'm receiving is completely abnormal.
My service provider is Digicube.fr, it's a really little company that doesn't seems to be able of handle everything in time. I not sure if there was no abuse complaints before end of October, but if there was, I never seen them.
I have tried everything: by mail or by the Web Interface that figures in the mails, with all these arguments:
- Since 08/18/2013, 95.130.10.70 and 95.130.9.89 are dedicated high speed Tor Exit Router, they do not host or share anything, they are just international network routers with empty hard disk drives.
- All reports you sent about these permanent IP Addresses (95.130.10.70 and 95.130.9.89) for several weeks are wrong: the IP Address that appears into your reports is the IP Address of the router, not the user.
- These routers and his responsible are NOT infringing any copyright. Neither technically nor legally.
- You got to understand that the goal of such a network is a way much fair goal than movies on the Internet. In March 2011, the Tor Project was awarded the Free Software Foundation's 2010 Award for Projects of Social Benefit on the following grounds: "Using free software, Tor has enabled roughly 36 million people around the world to experience freedom of access and expression on the Internet while keeping them in control of their privacy and anonymity. Its network has proved pivotal in dissident movements in both Iran and more recently Egypt."
But for both Irdeto and IP-Echelon, they don't care, and every day, the harassment procedure continues. I think they don't read my emails, I hope they can receive them; I never had any answers from them. I told them that if there is no answer, I will not have any reason to keep watching their emails... may be I need to ask my ISP to put a spam-filter about that, but I think that such a proposal have no chance to be welcome into an abuse service !
Don't be horrified: here is, below, the list of all abuse complaints I've received from them. You will understand why I love my ISP, and why I need to quickly find a solution! The olders ones are from October, 29 2013.
1 - IP-Echelon part :
notices.sony@ip-echelon.com : Unauthorized Distribution of the Copyrighted Motion Picture Entitled "White House Down" - Case ID 131400838 Unauthorized Distribution of the Copyrighted Motion Picture Entitled "White House Down" - Case ID 131396212 Unauthorized Distribution of the Copyrighted Motion Picture Entitled "White House Down" - Case ID 131732460
notices.warner@ip-echelon.com : Notice of Claimed Infringement - Case ID 130362722 Notice of Claimed Infringement - Case ID 130296727 Notice of Claimed Infringement - Case ID 130308292 Notice of Claimed Infringement - Case ID 131314345 Notice of Claimed Infringement - Case ID 131160950 Notice of Claimed Infringement - Case ID 131049815 Notice of Claimed Infringement - Case ID 131044521 Notice of Claimed Infringement - Case ID 130778319
2 - Irdeto part :
activision@copyright-compliance.com : 290-117780660 Notice of Unauthorized Use of Activision Property 290-117744045 Notice of Unauthorized Use of Activision Property 290-117740528 Notice of Unauthorized Use of Activision Property 290-117895342 Notice of Unauthorized Use of Activision Property 290-117877594 Notice of Unauthorized Use of Activision Property 290-117854157 Notice of Unauthorized Use of Activision Property 290-117818254 Notice of Unauthorized Use of Activision Property 290-118018138 Notice of Unauthorized Use of Activision Property 290-117983726 Notice of Unauthorized Use of Activision Property 290-117965572 Notice of Unauthorized Use of Activision Property 290-117961867 Notice of Unauthorized Use of Activision Property 290-118628905 Notice of Unauthorized Use of Activision Property 290-118491174 Notice of Unauthorized Use of Activision Property 290-118453073 Notice of Unauthorized Use of Activision Property 290-118398863 Notice of Unauthorized Use of Activision Property 290-118374287 Notice of Unauthorized Use of Activision Property
starz_media@copyright-compliance.com 314-117685560 Notice of Unauthorized Use of Starz, LLC ("Starz") Property 314-117684996 Notice of Unauthorized Use of Starz, LLC ("Starz") Property 314-117666358 Notice of Unauthorized Use of Starz, LLC ("Starz") Property 314-117666311 Notice of Unauthorized Use of Starz, LLC ("Starz") Property 314-117663952 Notice of Unauthorized Use of Starz, LLC ("Starz") Property 314-117653783 Notice of Unauthorized Use of Starz, LLC ("Starz") Property 314-117780831 Notice of Unauthorized Use of Starz, LLC ("Starz") Property 314-117509673 Notice of Unauthorized Use of Starz, LLC ("Starz") Property 314-117452028 Notice of Unauthorized Use of Starz, LLC ("Starz") Property 314-117258420 Notice of Unauthorized Use of Starz, LLC ("Starz") Property 314-117005314 Notice of Unauthorized Use of Starz, LLC ("Starz") Property 314-117827226 Notice of Unauthorized Use of Starz, LLC ("Starz") Property 314-118012162 Notice of Unauthorized Use of Starz, LLC ("Starz") Property
teachingcompany@copyright-compliance.com : 120-117780245 Unauthorized Use of The Teaching Company Limited Partnership Property
paramount@copyright-compliance.com : 22-116418467 Notice of Unauthorized Use of Paramount Pictures Corporation Property 22-116390947 Notice of Unauthorized Use of Paramount Pictures Corporation/Dreamworks Animation SKG, Inc. Property 22-116289727 Notice of Unauthorized Use of Paramount Pictures Corporation Property 22-116462954 Notice of Unauthorized Use of Paramount Pictures Corporation Property 22-116463639 Notice of Unauthorized Use of Paramount Pictures Corporation Property 22-116468964 Notice of Unauthorized Use of Paramount Pictures Corporation Property 22-117784969 Notice of Unauthorized Use of Paramount Pictures Corporation Property 22-117784422 Notice of Unauthorized Use of Paramount Pictures Corporation Property 22-117668962 Notice of Unauthorized Use of Paramount Pictures Corporation Property 22-117637379 Notice of Unauthorized Use of Paramount Pictures Corporation Property 22-117360665 Notice of Unauthorized Use of Paramount Pictures Corporation Property 22-117326212 Notice of Unauthorized Use of Paramount Pictures Corporation Property 22-117319457 Notice of Unauthorized Use of Paramount Pictures Corporation Property 22-117260566 Notice of Unauthorized Use of Paramount Pictures Corporation Property 22-117206174 Notice of Unauthorized Use of Paramount Pictures Corporation Property 22-117194860 Notice of Unauthorized Use of Paramount Pictures Corporation Property 22-117194189 Notice of Unauthorized Use of Paramount Pictures Corporation Property 22-117174717 Notice of Unauthorized Use of Paramount Pictures Corporation Property 22-117143821 Notice of Unauthorized Use of Paramount Pictures Corporation Property 22-117049672 Notice of Unauthorized Use of Paramount Pictures Corporation Property 22-116899426 Notice of Unauthorized Use of Paramount Pictures Corporation Property 22-116897671 Notice of Unauthorized Use of Paramount Pictures Corporation Property 22-116892769 Notice of Unauthorized Use of Paramount Pictures Corporation/Dreamworks Animation SKG, Inc. Property 22-116887099 Notice of Unauthorized Use of Paramount Pictures Corporation/Dreamworks Animation SKG, Inc. Property 22-116847203 Notice of Unauthorized Use of Paramount Pictures Corporation Property 22-117909973 Notice of Unauthorized Use of Paramount Pictures Corporation Property 22-117903528 Notice of Unauthorized Use of Paramount Pictures Corporation Property 22-117858364 Notice of Unauthorized Use of Paramount Pictures Corporation Property 22-117857551 Notice of Unauthorized Use of Paramount Pictures Corporation Property 22-117815491 Notice of Unauthorized Use of Paramount Pictures Corporation Property 22-117978380 Notice of Unauthorized Use of Paramount Pictures Corporation Property 22-117946018 Notice of Unauthorized Use of Paramount Pictures Corporation Property 22-117933311 Notice of Unauthorized Use of Paramount Pictures Corporation Property 22-117930244 Notice of Unauthorized Use of Paramount Pictures Corporation Property 22-117916165 Notice of Unauthorized Use of Paramount Pictures Corporation Property 22-118620584 Notice of Unauthorized Use of Paramount Pictures Corporation Property 22-118611592 Notice of Unauthorized Use of Paramount Pictures Corporation/Dreamworks Animation SKG, Inc. Property 22-118607311 Notice of Unauthorized Use of Paramount Pictures Corporation Property 22-118523821 Notice of Unauthorized Use of Paramount Pictures Corporation Property 22-118519781 Notice of Unauthorized Use of Paramount Pictures Corporation Property 22-118369725 Notice of Unauthorized Use of Paramount Pictures Corporation Property 22-118369726 Notice of Unauthorized Use of Paramount Pictures Corporation Property
----------------------------------------------------------------------- I wanted to die when my fingers have typed this sentence : /etc/init.d/tor stop And watching my server slowly going down... :(
I understood that a solution is to put a restricted exit policy, and only enable people to browse the web and nothing else, but before to do this and become something like "quarter of an exit node" (I'm kidding but you see what I mean ^^) I want to know if the amount of abuse complaint from Irdeto and IP-Echelon are normal with a full exit policy, or if I have a chance to make them stop while keep operating full exit nodes.
Thank you in advance, Arachnide needs your help !
Best regards, Julien ROBIN
PS : I will be at work the entire day tomorrow, sorry if I don't answer before tomorrow evening.
Hi,
One idea would be to ask the ISP, and maybe pay them a bit more for the additional workload in handling the complaints. One of our ISPs has decided to simply blackhole all complaints coming from Irdeto/IP-Echelon.
The other choice is to use a more restricted exit policy, like this one: https://trac.torproject.org/projects/tor/wiki/doc/ReducedExitPolicy
It allows many relevant ports to exit, but will cut down DMCA complaints to almost zero since it does not allow random ports.
Are they threatening any legal action? They're probably just trying to cover their asses. They are likely getting these notices from MPAA and other trolls, and are sending all of them along to you to make sure they are not legally liable for anything. But unless they are threatening legal action, maybe you can just ignore them? I am not a lawyer and have not run an exit node, so my suggestion could be worthless :)
Dan
On 11/13/2013 05:50 PM, Moritz Bartl wrote:
Hi,
One idea would be to ask the ISP, and maybe pay them a bit more for the additional workload in handling the complaints. One of our ISPs has decided to simply blackhole all complaints coming from Irdeto/IP-Echelon.
The other choice is to use a more restricted exit policy, like this one: https://trac.torproject.org/projects/tor/wiki/doc/ReducedExitPolicy
It allows many relevant ports to exit, but will cut down DMCA complaints to almost zero since it does not allow random ports.
Hi Dan and Moritz,
Thank you very much for your answers.
So my case is not the only one with this kind of automatized abuses complaints, it's really important for me to know this.
Dan your idea is very interesting because it matches with Moritz's idea and as you say, there is absolutely no legal action, just harassment paid by private company, trying to make ISP to cut down the Internet Access of people who download and share movies and others copyrighted products.
I already sent a mail to my ISP to tell them about my use of the servers and tell them I completely agree to pay a "different offer" if it makes more sense (and I think: of course, it would make more sense). Since yesterday, abuse complaints flow is suspended, so I will retry to contact them about that. I also tried by phone call but nobody never answers ^^ but I will continue to try.
To finish, the fact that an ISP already blocked this kind of "commercial harassment" is very important for my case, because I can talk about it to my ISP, and tell them that this is not something foolish that cannot be done.
I will tell you about what will be said by my ISP, and I look forward to restart my servers without going right to a precipice. If I have no answer by my ISP it will be necessary for me to set a reduced Exit Policy : if I don't have a lot of abuse complaints it will be OK (they have been OK to transmit 85 abuse complaints (2 more from yesterday) in 2 weeks without making any remark so I can hope that will be OK).
Have a nice day (or night!) Best regards,
Julien ROBIN
----- Mail original ----- De: "Dan Staples" danstaples@disman.tl À: tor-relays@lists.torproject.org Envoyé: Jeudi 14 Novembre 2013 00:32:02 Objet: Re: [tor-relays] Huge harrassment by Irdeto and IP-Echelon, 83 mails, in 2 weeks, need your help
Are they threatening any legal action? They're probably just trying to cover their asses. They are likely getting these notices from MPAA and other trolls, and are sending all of them along to you to make sure they are not legally liable for anything. But unless they are threatening legal action, maybe you can just ignore them? I am not a lawyer and have not run an exit node, so my suggestion could be worthless :)
Dan
On 11/13/2013 05:50 PM, Moritz Bartl wrote:
Hi,
One idea would be to ask the ISP, and maybe pay them a bit more for the additional workload in handling the complaints. One of our ISPs has decided to simply blackhole all complaints coming from Irdeto/IP-Echelon.
The other choice is to use a more restricted exit policy, like this one: https://trac.torproject.org/projects/tor/wiki/doc/ReducedExitPolicy
It allows many relevant ports to exit, but will cut down DMCA complaints to almost zero since it does not allow random ports.
I would prefer to receive a lot of such abuse complaints, forwarded unfiltered, than to let the ISP cut off the relay. At least that way they are passing on the responsibility closer to the source of the problem (that they know of), rather than making decisions over which the relay operator has no control. The question is, are they giving you deadlines to handle all those complaints? or is it entirely between you and the complainant?
Hello krishna,
I agree with you as I also think that the approach you describes (your ISP transmit to you, almost "don't care" and just want you to do the job and copy to them) is so much better :) and I really think my ISP is trying to work like that.
There was absolutely no remarks or whatever else in the mails they transmitted to me. In their terms and conditions it's just written that they have to be able to see the mail exchanges, so that they know when the problem is solved.
But there was so many messages they received during the last 3-day week end, so many that they haven't been able to transmit all of them on the begining of the week (there was a 3 day hole betwen November 7 and November 11 on the mails they was transmitting to me on November 13. And, they started to transmit me in the morning and in the evening it was still not finished ! This last detail was the alarm signal for me, that's when I realized that it was going straight into a pricipice. I also realized that these abuse complaints weren't going to stop, even with my efforts by sending mails to Irdeto and IP-Echelon.
To keep you informed :
I just sent to my ISP the mail as we said (sum-up) :
- I'm ok if they calculate a more suitable price for my intensive use of their services, - I also explained them that Irdeto/IP-Echelon abuses can be ignored in my case : the IP address on the reports are not the address of the responsible user. These 2 companies just never stops to send an unconscionable amount of email to put pressure, because sometimes, unfortunately, it works (and it's bad when it works !) and they never read our answers. I told them that some ISP already decided to blackhole these Irdeto/IP-Echelon notifications in a similar case.
I will now be waiting for them to answer, but as I know them, I'm not completely sure to have my answer, and in the better case, probably not before Monday (11/18/2013).
I'm re-starting my servers as only relays for this week end (to be sure that no abuse complaint could flood my ISP, so they will be able to see my email !) and if my ISP does not answer, Reduced Exit Policy will be my only suitable solution.
I will keep you informed! Thank you again for all your help and remarks, and sorry when my answers are very late (too large working days)
Best regards, Julien ROBIN
----- Mail original ----- De: "krishna e bera" keb@cyblings.on.ca À: tor-relays@lists.torproject.org Envoyé: Jeudi 14 Novembre 2013 21:13:11 Objet: Re: [tor-relays] Huge harrassment by Irdeto and IP-Echelon, 83 mails, in 2 weeks, need your help
I would prefer to receive a lot of such abuse complaints, forwarded unfiltered, than to let the ISP cut off the relay. At least that way they are passing on the responsibility closer to the source of the problem (that they know of), rather than making decisions over which the relay operator has no control. The question is, are they giving you deadlines to handle all those complaints? or is it entirely between you and the complainant?
_______________________________________________ tor-relays mailing list tor-relays@lists.torproject.org https://lists.torproject.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/tor-relays
julien.robin28@free.fr:
Hello krishna,
I agree with you as I also think that the approach you describes (your ISP transmit to you, almost "don't care" and just want you to do the job and copy to them) is so much better :) and I really think my ISP is trying to work like that.
There was absolutely no remarks or whatever else in the mails they transmitted to me. In their terms and conditions it's just written that they have to be able to see the mail exchanges, so that they know when the problem is solved.
But there was so many messages they received during the last 3-day week end, so many that they haven't been able to transmit all of them on the begining of the week (there was a 3 day hole betwen November 7 and November 11 on the mails they was transmitting to me on November 13. And, they started to transmit me in the morning and in the evening it was still not finished ! This last detail was the alarm signal for me, that's when I realized that it was going straight into a pricipice. I also realized that these abuse complaints weren't going to stop, even with my efforts by sending mails to Irdeto and IP-Echelon.
To keep you informed :
I just sent to my ISP the mail as we said (sum-up) :
- I'm ok if they calculate a more suitable price for my intensive use of their services,
- I also explained them that Irdeto/IP-Echelon abuses can be ignored in my case : the IP address on the reports are not the address of the responsible user. These 2 companies just never stops to send an unconscionable amount of email to put pressure, because sometimes, unfortunately, it works (and it's bad when it works !) and they never read our answers. I told them that some ISP already decided to blackhole these Irdeto/IP-Echelon notifications in a similar case.
I will now be waiting for them to answer, but as I know them, I'm not completely sure to have my answer, and in the better case, probably not before Monday (11/18/2013).
I'm re-starting my servers as only relays for this week end (to be sure that no abuse complaint could flood my ISP, so they will be able to see my email !) and if my ISP does not answer, Reduced Exit Policy will be my only suitable solution.
I will keep you informed! Thank you again for all your help and remarks, and sorry when my answers are very late (too large working days)
Best regards, Julien ROBIN
thanks for posting. even if it's unfortunate for you that's encouraging to read.
----- Mail original ----- De: "krishna e bera" keb@cyblings.on.ca À: tor-relays@lists.torproject.org Envoyé: Jeudi 14 Novembre 2013 21:13:11 Objet: Re: [tor-relays] Huge harrassment by Irdeto and IP-Echelon, 83 mails, in 2 weeks, need your help
I would prefer to receive a lot of such abuse complaints, forwarded unfiltered, than to let the ISP cut off the relay. At least that way they are passing on the responsibility closer to the source of the problem (that they know of), rather than making decisions over which the relay operator has no control. The question is, are they giving you deadlines to handle all those complaints? or is it entirely between you and the complainant?
tor-relays mailing list tor-relays@lists.torproject.org https://lists.torproject.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/tor-relays _______________________________________________ tor-relays mailing list tor-relays@lists.torproject.org https://lists.torproject.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/tor-relays
Hello everybody,
Just to keep you informed - and to tell you that my case may probably now be considered as "solved"
-I decided to put a Reduced Exit Policy: if my ISP already transmitted to me 83 abuses notifications in 2 weeks without cutting down my servers, the few abuses notifications that will happen with Reduced Exit Policy will be OK.
-I didn't have any answer by my ISP :( as if they absolutely don't care of nothing, or don’t have enough time. It sounds like I will never know their feeling about my exit nodes! With no hope of any clear agreement with my ISP, it will probably not be reasonable for me to put a Full Exit Policy on my servers without taking the risk to lose them soon or late. But to let Irdeto and IP-Echelon spams to win and trample on our common freedom is a little bit exasperating!
My 2 "ArachnideFR35" servers will now probably come back to their previous bandwidth (12200KB/s and 3800KB/s) in the following days and weeks. (But with a little bit less available ports!)
Thank you very much for all your mails and advices ;) Stay motivated!
Best regards to all, Julien ROBIN
----- Mail original ----- De: "Martin Kepplinger" martink@posteo.de À: tor-relays@lists.torproject.org Envoyé: Mardi 19 Novembre 2013 12:57:50 Objet: Re: [tor-relays] Huge harrassment by Irdeto and IP-Echelon, 83 mails, in 2 weeks, need your help
julien.robin28@free.fr:
Hello krishna,
I agree with you as I also think that the approach you describes (your ISP transmit to you, almost "don't care" and just want you to do the job and copy to them) is so much better :) and I really think my ISP is trying to work like that.
There was absolutely no remarks or whatever else in the mails they transmitted to me. In their terms and conditions it's just written that they have to be able to see the mail exchanges, so that they know when the problem is solved.
But there was so many messages they received during the last 3-day week end, so many that they haven't been able to transmit all of them on the begining of the week (there was a 3 day hole betwen November 7 and November 11 on the mails they was transmitting to me on November 13. And, they started to transmit me in the morning and in the evening it was still not finished ! This last detail was the alarm signal for me, that's when I realized that it was going straight into a pricipice. I also realized that these abuse complaints weren't going to stop, even with my efforts by sending mails to Irdeto and IP-Echelon.
To keep you informed :
I just sent to my ISP the mail as we said (sum-up) :
- I'm ok if they calculate a more suitable price for my intensive use of their services,
- I also explained them that Irdeto/IP-Echelon abuses can be ignored in my case : the IP address on the reports are not the address of the responsible user. These 2 companies just never stops to send an unconscionable amount of email to put pressure, because sometimes, unfortunately, it works (and it's bad when it works !) and they never read our answers. I told them that some ISP already decided to blackhole these Irdeto/IP-Echelon notifications in a similar case.
I will now be waiting for them to answer, but as I know them, I'm not completely sure to have my answer, and in the better case, probably not before Monday (11/18/2013).
I'm re-starting my servers as only relays for this week end (to be sure that no abuse complaint could flood my ISP, so they will be able to see my email !) and if my ISP does not answer, Reduced Exit Policy will be my only suitable solution.
I will keep you informed! Thank you again for all your help and remarks, and sorry when my answers are very late (too large working days)
Best regards, Julien ROBIN
thanks for posting. even if it's unfortunate for you that's encouraging to read.
----- Mail original ----- De: "krishna e bera" keb@cyblings.on.ca À: tor-relays@lists.torproject.org Envoyé: Jeudi 14 Novembre 2013 21:13:11 Objet: Re: [tor-relays] Huge harrassment by Irdeto and IP-Echelon, 83 mails, in 2 weeks, need your help
I would prefer to receive a lot of such abuse complaints, forwarded unfiltered, than to let the ISP cut off the relay. At least that way they are passing on the responsibility closer to the source of the problem (that they know of), rather than making decisions over which the relay operator has no control. The question is, are they giving you deadlines to handle all those complaints? or is it entirely between you and the complainant?
tor-relays mailing list tor-relays@lists.torproject.org https://lists.torproject.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/tor-relays _______________________________________________ tor-relays mailing list tor-relays@lists.torproject.org https://lists.torproject.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/tor-relays
_______________________________________________ tor-relays mailing list tor-relays@lists.torproject.org https://lists.torproject.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/tor-relays
Is there a document somewhere I can refer my ISP to showing that other ISPs have decided to blackhole Irdeto/IP-Echelon complaints?
-Pascal
On 11/13/2013 4:50 PM, Moritz Bartl wrote:
Hi,
One of our ISPs has decided to simply blackhole all complaints coming from Irdeto/IP-Echelon.
tor-relays@lists.torproject.org
-
Dan Staples -
julien.robin28＠free.fr -
krishna e bera -
Martin Kepplinger -
Moritz Bartl -
Pascal